Etiquette

[Inexperienced]

There is an interesting thread developing regarding "E" grade at KOCC last weekend. Allegedly, a young man sat on the back for the majority of the race, and then sprinted to the win. The winner was chastised by an older competitor of the race, which resulted in action taken by the commissar.

Now while I'm sure everyone is in agreement that there is no place for abuse of any kind in our sport, there is an etiquette for "taking your turn at the front" during a race. It is that etiquette I'd like to explore with this post.

Everyone would agree that different people have different strengths and weaknesses. Some people are good at TT; some people are good at sprinting; some people are good at climbing. Why then, should someone who has strengths in sprinting be required via etiquette to "take a turn at the front"? Shouldn't the better time trialers/escapists try to escape from the pack, or at least make it so hard for the "sprinters" that they fall off the back?

If escapists broke away or put the hurt on week after week, the sprinters would surely have to change their behaviour should they want to win? To be honest, I've never seen a breakaway succeed in the low grade I race in (not that I've been racing long). While there certainly are the odd "surges" from the pack, I don't even recall anyone really attempting to get away. That said, should a rider (or small group) get away on a regular basis in the very lowest grade, it could have a negative impact on developing riders who do not currently have the capacity to chase down such breakaways. This would surely be demoralizing, and could push people away from the sport.

Where has the etiquette of taking your turn come from? Has it just been passed down from generation to generation? Is it part of a strategy to create stronger, more rounded riders? In theory it will make you a better rider (at the very least, a more rounded rider if you are a sprinter).  Is there some other reason why "taking your turn" is expected?

At what point does the etiquette of "doing your turn at the front" stop? Obviously the pro riders don't "take their turn". They are focussed on doing what they can for either themselves or their team to win. However, from what I understand, there is still a hierarchy inside the pro peleton; which has its own etiquette. Does the requirement of "doing your turn" stop at "A" grade? When you’re a member of a team? At some other level?

Obviously, this is a fairly polarizing topic. My intension with these questions is to answer my own curiosity about the topic, plus be able to explain the reasons of why we should "take our turn" to both new riders and other people outside our sport.

[2ndwheel]

Inexperienced (but not for to long)

It's a can of worms. It would be easier to ask ridres why they don't do a turn (a cyclict has all the excuses under the sun eg tired,not training,to windy,i'm not chasing a break)

regards

A Sprinter

[Proudly hairy-legged]

Yes this is a can of worms. Similar to SMH articles on whether bikes should be registered and journos complaining about those pesky cyclists getting to work more quickly than they do, this thread is sure to generate a good deal of responses for a day or two.

To be honest I don't really care if people don't do turns. For me, doing turns on the front is making me a stronger rider, and that's my primary focus. To have the goal of "Win the race so save as much energy as possible throughout" is a bit short-sighted, in my opinion (apologies for not using non-newspaper acronyms here; don't trust them). I have more fun when I'm doing big turns on the front, sometimes giving some pain to the people sitting in, more often than not just giving pain to myself. Sitting in on the back is not a fun race, but that's just my opinion.

If these people win I don't really care either. If I can get a result at the end in addition to having done some work throughout the race, this is good times. I enjoy racing and, not that I don't try my guts out for them, the results are a bonus if they come.

What about working in a breakaway? Surely whatever etiquette rules exist for doing turns on the front of the bunch are doubled for doing work in a breakaway?

These are just my thoughts.

[Robbo]

As has been said, there is no written rule regarding this. You say there is no such etiquette in the pro ranks but if you look at the pro riders, if there are a couple of them in a break away and one of them isnt pulling turns he still earns the wrath of his break away companions.

We have all suffered on the back due to lack of form or the magnificent form of others. One thing you notice while back there is the constant accelerations required due to the elastic band effect. Those who actually choose to ride there must be weirdos because it is a reactive place to be, not proactive. Why race if thats what you want to do?

Anyway, wheel suckers or whatever they get called are still riding within the rules. Abusive riders are not. End of story.

[Boostland]

In quite a few situations it's actually easier to be up the front and doing short turns rather than back in the pack, try riding some opens with narrow roads and big bunches and crosswinds, if you think you can sit down the back and wait for a sprint finish then good luck as you might find you are watching the race ride up the road when the bunch splits up, this has happened quite a few times in the G2T race on the Breeza plains, I got caught out the 2nd year I raced there and had to do a very hard chase back on, I was up close to the front but someone let the wheel go as the pace was really on Ian Lovell almost got dropped as well after doing a hard turn to help get back on as he did not realise we had dropped so many riders and missed my wheel as he came back.

The last couple of years I have taken note of the winds and made sure I was at the front and even turned it on with Max helping and got the others working to split the bunch, I think we dropped over 1/2 of the bunch by just putting in a bit of effort at the right time.

When in the lower grades if you want to get up the grades it's pointless sitting on and winning the sprint even if your a sprinter, as when you do go up the next grade you will find it very hard to keep up, best thing to do is go to the front do turns, chase attacks then counter attack and try to win in a break then when you do get up a grade you will be able to ride at or near the front and be competitive right away.

When I came back to racing after a 16 odd year break I got dropped in the first lap of a C grade race, it could have made some not come back but I decided that I need to train more and harder, so the following week I raced and asked to be put in D grade I managed to finish it on the back of the bunch I even managed to do a few turns here and there but damn it hurt and I had no chance of sprinting at the end, 6 weeks later I was one of the strong riders in D but I was not getting places as I wanted to get my skills and speed back before attempting to move up.

A few months later I was just sitting on the front of D and dragging them around, one race I think I did 3/4 of a lap on the front before anyone rolled past, and was driving them into head winds at 36 - 38 km/h, I think they were glad to see me get put up to C grade by the end, and when I was put into C I rode on the front as much as I could as I had built my strength up to a level where I was comfortable in the higher grade.

It's all how you look at it and what you want to get out of it.

At the moment I will probably be called a sitter as I have lost quite a bit since my crash, and have not finished a race since (well two were due to a punctures, but I was hoping I got them to stop the pain )

[commando]

sportsmanship
its really bad sportsmanship to not take a few turns while partaking in a bike race.
now sportsmanship is something thats is in the rule book and can have rules made about
many at racing have no asperations to improve or try hard
this is causing many of the issues at racing
commano's 2 cents

[Metro Commuter]

Inexperienced,

A very thought provoking topic, and I suspect one that does not have a single 100% correct answer.

The underlying premises of your post is, respectfully, very sound - people have differing strengths and weaknesses, and ought to be able to ride to their strengths and exploit the weaknesses of those who they race against. The essence of racing.  

“Taking your turn” would seem to be the antithesis of the individualistic approach, as “taking your turn” involves an element of collective effort for a common goal (less effort for more speed).

The custom of being required to “take your turn” probably has developed over time, but I guess it has its origins in fairness.  Drafting confers a real advantage, and it might be said to be unfair for riders to draft behind other riders without bearing any, or less, of the burden involved with providing a draft.

The custom may also be derived from provide racers of more similar abilities and so closer races.  I can see how that might happen, although in my experience those who wheel suck then sprint to fight their way up the grades do less well once up in a higher grade.  Those who take far more than their fair share of turns, and still survive in the break or sprint to win, do better when they go a grade.  There are exceptions bit for the most part the opportunistic wheel sucker does not do as well when they are up a grade.

Good point, with respect, about where the custom to take your turn ends.  I think the answer is “it depends”.  Think of these situations:

•   The difference with pro riders is not so much that they are pros, but that they race in teams.  Within a team there are the workers and there are the protected riders, so the workers take the turns while the stars stay fresh.  The team takes its turn when other customs require (eg protecting the front running GC rider) or tactics require.

•   Close to a finish, or a prime, the requirement to “take a turn” ends – when you get to that point then the collective benefit of drafting ends, and it comes down to individual finishing ability and tactics.  Note I did not talk about sprinting ability and tactics, because the good time trialist might attack a fair way from the finish because he (or she) knows that the sprinters will not have the stamina to maintain a high pace and a sprint, just as a sprinter will probably find it better to keep the pace low until a short distance from the finish and use greater acceleration to win.

•   An interesting issue is how the requirement to take a turn seems to vary depending on the work you have done. The more work you have dome the more people, including fence sitters, let you do what you want.  

•   “Taking your turn” is, from my observation,  a custom that exists in all local grades, and wherever the custom exists there are those who push the bounds of that norm for their benefit by wheelsitting as much as they can.  Listen to the A graders **** and moan after a hard race with a cross-wind.

However, I think drafting does become more tactical as you move up the grades.  In a B grade race in a strong cross-wind most riders will “ride up the gutter” to string people out and cause riders to get dropped, but it is rare to see in a C grade race in the same conditions (and then only when there are people who have raced from higher grades), and I can not recall it ever happening in D or E grade when I raced in those grades.  

[drv31t]

Then there is the handicap race. You would think that the group would work together & roll through to do a short turn. Nuh-uh. The group I ride in have 5/6 riders having a go at keeping a good tempo, & the other 6 riders as passengers. On the last lap, the passengers wait for the chasers to catch us, then jump on the back of that group to be taken to the line. Poor form if you ask me.

If you are not interested in putting in an effort to help the group stay away from the chasing bunch, then stay at the line till the group you want to wheel suck off is leaving & go with them....

As for scratch races. If you can do a turn, then do so. If you can't, don't try to sprint for the line if you have been sucking wheel all race. Another case of Poor Form if you ask me. Then to be given the excuse that they are a sprinter, please..............wake up to yourself. There are probobly only a handfull of true sprinters in Newcastle area, & I guarantee none of them are in the lower grades.

Just my opinion....

[Metro Commuter]

Then there is the handicap race. You would think that the group would work together & roll through to do a short turn. Nuh-uh. The group I ride in have 5/6 riders having a go at keeping a good tempo, & the other 6 riders as passengers. On the last lap, the passengers wait for the chasers to catch us, then jump on the back of that group to be taken to the line. Poor form if you ask me.

If you are not interested in putting in an effort to help the group stay away from the chasing bunch, then stay at the line till the group you want to wheel suck off is leaving & go with them....

As for scratch races. If you can do a turn, then do so. If you can't, don't try to sprint for the line if you have been sucking wheel all race. Another case of Poor Form if you ask me. Then to be given the excuse that they are a sprinter, please..............wake up to yourself. There are probobly only a handfull of true sprinters in Newcastle area, & I guarantee none of them are in the lower grades.

Just my opinion....

Agree 100% - although when 2nd Wheel slides back in to C grade - and has very good reasons why he can not train - he is a ure srpinter, and none can touch him if he gets to the finish.

[giantcfr1]

So what about if you are simply racing for fitness, have no intention of contesting the sprint - but just want to work on staying with the pack to build up your fitness and are quite happy to pull off at the end? should you cop abuse for this?

[Metro Commuter]

Well, you should not be abused any time, but you might be the subject of polite adverse comments...but if you are not really racing then you may stuff it up for those that are unless you make it very plain you are not really racing.  I think that no one has a problem with a person who has to wheel suck just to complete the race - the problem is with people who wheel suck THEN sprint with fresh legs. 

In some ways it is like being in a break (yes, I have been in a few) and asking the question "are you sprinting?", to be told "no" then have the person sprint - not cool.

[drv31t]

Giantcfr1, thats my point, if you don't take a turn, & roll to the finish, all good with that. I have done the same. But, to sprint to the line in my eyes is not cool.

[Inexperienced]

Thanks everyone, for their considered responses. I feel like I have a really suitable answer to my question of "How do I explain this to someone outside of our sport" - and that is the concept of "sportmanship" or "fairness".

For me, this is the first sport I have attempted in which I compete as an individual. While sportmanship is almost implied in many team sports, this wasn't as obvious with cycling. Now that I am reminded of this most basic of courtesies, it justifies a great many rules of thumb and cycling etiquette.

[Inexperienced]

Then there is the handicap race. You would think that the group would work together & roll through to do a short turn. Nuh-uh. The group I ride in have 5/6 riders having a go at keeping a good tempo, & the other 6 riders as passengers. On the last lap, the passengers wait for the chasers to catch us, then jump on the back of that group to be taken to the line. Poor form if you ask me.
If you are not interested in putting in an effort to help the group stay away from the chasing bunch, then stay at the line till the group you want to wheel suck off is leaving & go with them....

Wow - that really resonates with me as you put it "poor form". My view of handicaps is that they are like a team time trial. You work together and really flog yourself to try and stay away from the group behind (and catch any groups in front).
While my pacing in handicaps is so bad that I cook myself and fly out of my group like I've "put it in reverse", I do hope to finish one some day.

As for scratch races. If you can do a turn, then do so. If you can't, don't try to sprint for the line if you have been sucking wheel all race. Another case of Poor Form if you ask me. Then to be given the excuse that they are a sprinter, please..............wake up to yourself. There are probobly only a handfull of true sprinters in Newcastle area, & I guarantee none of them are in the lower grades.

Just out of curiosity, how do you define a "true sprinter"? By the law of averages, should there not be an even distribution of sprinters to all-rounders to climbers to pursuiters?
I consider myself a sprinter yet I am not a very good one (not very fit/fast). My "feel" and data suggests I am one (I have a down-sloping plot for my power profile as per Allen & Coggan).
That said, I hope that I do my fair share at the front - although when the hammer is down, my lack of fitness sometimes does complain about the effort.

[giantcfr1]

gee i miss being able to sprint I don't seem to have the legs at the end of a race anymore. Sigh!